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Does lilo still have a limit on it's menu entries?

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All my Debian installs, Sarge, Etch, and Lenny, originally started off as
Woody 3.0r2, and LiLo was, and still is the bootloader. I installed on Etch
yesterday the 2.6.18-5 kernel, which shows up in /boot ok, but running lilo
doesn't add it to lilo's menu.

I read a while back that earlier versions of lilo could only have 6 entries on
the menu. My lilo version is 1:22.6.1-9.3.

The original kernel when I installed Woody 3.0r2 was a bf one. It is still
listed in /boot, and on lilo's menu. but is nowhere to be seen in synaptic,
and no longer will boot with Etch. On the face of it, I can't see how to
remove this original boot floppy kernel.

Can I just delete all references to the 2.4.18-bf2.4 kernel in /boot? Then run
lilo again. It seems a bit of a hack, but I can't see any way around it as
synaptic doesn't even list the bf kernel, and you can't uninstall something
that's not on the list.

/etc/lilo.conf is below. There are 2 entries for the bf kernel, making 7
entries in total, but I'm presuming that as both bf entries are pointing to
the same kernel, lilo is reasoning that only 6 kernel entries are listed on
the menu, but I may well be wrong in my reasoning.

# /etc/lilo.conf - See: `lilo(8)' and `lilo.conf(5)',
# --------------- `install-mbr(8)', `/usr/share/doc/lilo/',
# and `/usr/share/doc/mbr/'.

# +---------------------------------------------------------------+
# | !! Reminder !! |
# | |
# | Don't forget to run `lilo' after you make changes to this |
# | conffile, `/boot/bootmess.txt', or install a new kernel. The |
# | computer will most likely fail to boot if a kernel-image |
# | post-install script or you don't remember to run `lilo'. |
# | |
# +---------------------------------------------------------------+

# Support LBA for large hard disks.
#
lba32

# Overrides the default mapping between harddisk names and the BIOS'
# harddisk order. Use with caution.
#disk=/dev/hde
# bios=0x81

#disk=/dev/sda
# bios=0x80

# Specifies the boot device. This is where Lilo installs its boot
# block. It can be either a partition, or the raw device, in which
# case it installs in the MBR, and will overwrite the current MBR.
#
boot=/dev/hda5

# Specifies the device that should be mounted as root. (`/')
#
root=/dev/hda5

# Enable map compaction:
# Tries to merge read requests for adjacent sectors into a single
# read request. This drastically reduces load time and keeps the
# map smaller. Using `compact' is especially recommended when
# booting from a floppy disk. It is disabled here by default
# because it doesn't always work.
#
# compact

# Installs the specified file as the new boot sector
# You have the choice between: bmp, compat, menu and text
# Look in /boot/ and in lilo.conf(5) manpage for details
#
install=/boot/boot-menu.b

# Specifies the location of the map file
#
map=/boot/map

# You can set a password here, and uncomment the `restricted' lines
# in the image definitions below to make it so that a password must
# be typed to boot anything but a default configuration. If a
# command line is given, other than one specified by an `append'
# statement in `lilo.conf', the password will be required, but a
# standard default boot will not require one.
#
# This will, for instance, prevent anyone with access to the
# console from booting with something like `Linux init=/bin/sh',
# and thus becoming `root' without proper authorization.
#
# Note that if you really need this type of security, you will
# likely also want to use `install-mbr' to reconfigure the MBR
# program, as well as set up your BIOS to disallow booting from
# removable disk or CD-ROM, then put a password on getting into the
# BIOS configuration as well. Please RTFM `install-mbr(8)'.
#
# password=tatercounter2000

# Specifies the number of deciseconds (0.1 seconds) LILO should
# wait before booting the first image.
#
delay=20

# You can put a customized boot message up if you like. If you use
# `prompt', and this computer may need to reboot unattended, you
# must specify a `timeout', or it will sit there forever waiting
# for a keypress. `single-key' goes with the `alias' lines in the
# `image' configurations below. eg: You can press `1' to boot
# `Linux', `2' to boot `LinuxOLD', if you uncomment the `alias'.
#
# message=/boot/bootmess.txt
prompt
timeout=150
# prompt
# single-key
# delay=100
# timeout=100

# Specifies the VGA text mode at boot time. (normal, extended, ask, )
#
# vga=ask
# vga=9
#
vga=normal

# Kernel command line options that apply to all installed images go
# here. See: The `boot-prompt-HOWO' and `kernel-parameters.txt' in
# the Linux kernel `Documentation' directory.
#
# append=""

# Boot up Linux by default.
#
default=Linux

image=/boot/vmlinuz-2.4.18-bf2.4
label=Linux
read-only
# restricted
# alias=1

image=/boot/vmlinuz-2.4.18-bf2.4
label=LinuxOLD
read-only
optional
# restricted
# alias=2

# If you have another OS on this machine to boot, you can uncomment the
# following lines, changing the device name on the `other' line to
# where your other OS' partition is.
#
# other=/dev/hda4
# label=HURD
# restricted
# alias=3

image=/boot/vmlinuz-2.4.27-2-386
label=Linuxalsa
initrd=/boot/initrd.img-2.4.27-2-386
read-only

image=/boot/vmlinuz-2.6.8-3-386
label=Linux2.6-386
initrd=/boot/initrd.img-2.6.8-3-386
read-only

image=/boot/vmlinuz-2.6.17-2-686
label=Linux2.6.17
initrd=/boot/initrd.img-2.6.17-2-686
read-only

image=/boot/vmlinuz-2.6.18-3-686
label=Linux2.6.18-3
initrd=/boot/initrd.img-2.6.18-3-686
read-only

image=/boot/vmlinuz-2.6.18-4-686
label=Linux2.6.18-4
initrd=/boot/initrd.img-2.6.18-4-686
read-only

I should have kernel 2.6.18-5-686 here as well, if lilo can handle more than 6
menu items now.

Comments welcome.

Nigel.

btw: I don't particularly want to replace lilo with grub. I know grub can
handle multiple menu entries, as on my Fedora installs. I just thought that
later versions of lilo had resolved the 6 menu entries limit.

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Does lilo still have a limit on it's menu entries?

Submitted by Nigel Henry on Sat, 2007-09-29 13:00.

On Saturday 29 September 2007 01:54, C. G. Montgomery wrote:
> In linux.debian.user Nigel Henry wrote:
> > I read a while back that earlier versions of lilo could only have 6
> > entries on the menu. My lilo version is 1:22.6.1-9.3.
>
> I think it may not be a limit on the number of lilo entries. Not long
> ago, an upgrade to 2.6.21-2-k7 was done on a machine of mine. This put
> the initrd.img, System.map, and vmlinuz files into /boot but didn't
> change lilo.conf. In fact I decided to stay with the kernel I had been
> using, so it's just waiting there. I don't know whether grub is handled
> differently.

I had the same when I installed the 2.6.18-5-686 kernel. The files were
in /boot, but /etc/lilo.conf hadn't been updated, therefore running lilo did
nothing. I commented out the stanzas for the bf2 kernel, and added the
stanzas for the new 2.6.18-5 one, ran lilo, and now it's on lilo's menu.

The reason I asked about the 6 menu items limit was because I seem to remember
that during the adding of new kernels previously, that apt-get would prompt
you for lilo, mentioning something about the boot block, and if you wanted to
run lilo, and install it in the MBR. Now my lilo's arn't in the MBR, but in
the / partition for my 2 Debian installs on this drive. Grub for FC2 is in
the MBR, as it is the 1st Linux install on the drive. Not wishing Grub to be
replaced, I said no to the apt-get yes/no request, and ran lilo after the
install had completed. Now that I've effectively removed the references to
the bf2 kernel I may remove this latest kernel, and try reinstalling it, just
to see if I get this prompt for lilo with apt-get.

Regarding Grub. At least on Fedora it works fine, and all kernel updates are
added to it's menu. You can add as many kernels as you like. I suspect after
a while you get a scroll bar to look through them. Saying that though, with
fedora I also use Apt, but if you use Yum, which is the default package
manager on Fedora, it only keeps 2 kernels as default, but you can change
that behaviour so that all kernels are saved. Personally I think it's best
that all kernels are saved, then you can decide which ones are no longer
required.
>
> > The original kernel when I installed Woody 3.0r2 was a bf one. It is
> > still listed in /boot, and on lilo's menu. but is nowhere to be seen in
> > synaptic, and no longer will boot with Etch. On the face of it, I can't
> > see how to remove this original boot floppy kernel.
> >
> > Can I just delete all references to the 2.4.18-bf2.4 kernel in /boot?
> > Then run lilo again. It seems a bit of a hack, but I can't see any way
> > around it as synaptic doesn't even list the bf kernel, and you can't
> > uninstall something that's not on the list.
>
> Yes, I've done just that to get rid of old kernels. Just edit lilo.conf
> to include only the stanzas you want and run lilo.

As I mention above I commented out the stanzas for the bf2 in /etc/lilo.conf,
and renamed the bf2 files in /boot. I'll clean that up later on as everything
appears to be working ok now.
>
> hth cgm

Thanks for your reply.

Nigel.

--

»

Does lilo still have a limit on it's menu entries?

Submitted by Nigel Henry on Sat, 2007-09-29 13:00.

On Saturday 29 September 2007 05:04, Mumia W.. wrote:
> On 09/28/2007 03:18 PM, Nigel Henry wrote:
> > All my Debian installs, Sarge, Etch, and Lenny, originally started off as
> > Woody 3.0r2, and LiLo was, and still is the bootloader. I installed on
> > Etch yesterday the 2.6.18-5 kernel, which shows up in /boot ok, but
> > running lilo doesn't add it to lilo's menu.
> >
> > I read a while back that earlier versions of lilo could only have 6
> > entries on the menu. My lilo version is 1:22.6.1-9.3.
> >
> > The original kernel when I installed Woody 3.0r2 was a bf one. It is
> > still listed in /boot, and on lilo's menu. but is nowhere to be seen in
> > synaptic, and no longer will boot with Etch. On the face of it, I can't
> > see how to remove this original boot floppy kernel.
> >
> > Can I just delete all references to the 2.4.18-bf2.4 kernel in /boot?
> > Then run lilo again. It seems a bit of a hack, but I can't see any way
> > around it as synaptic doesn't even list the bf kernel, and you can't
> > uninstall something that's not on the list.
> >
> > /etc/lilo.conf is below. [...]
>
> I have very little experience with Lilo under Debian, though I used it
> under Slackware.

I first encountered lilo on Mandrake 9.2, and must admit that I had terrible
problems with both LiLo, and Grub when I first started off with Linux, and
setting up dual, and triple boot installs. I've sort of got them under
control now, but it wasn't much fun at the time. Now the bootloader for the
first install goes in the MBR, and the bootloaders for the subsequent
installs go in their respective / partitions. Then I boot up the first
install and add chainloaders pointing to the / partitions of the other
distros on the drive.
>
> I don't know about the six item limit, but I suggest you manually delete
> the references to the bf kernels, but read "man liloconfig" and "man
> update-lilo" first. If the bf kernels do not appear in /boot,
> update-lilo may remove them from /etc/lilo.conf automatically.

I've temporarily renamed the bf2 files in /boot, and commented out the stanzas
for the bf2 kernel in /etc/lilo.conf, but am going to remove them completely
as they are no longer useable on Etch.
>
> I also suggest that you remove, possibly using synaptic, any kernels
> that don't boot the system up properly.

I usually keep all kernels. Alright the ones that don't boot properly can go,
but sometimes older, non udev ones, are usefull to keep if you are appearing
to have problems with the udev ones. I constantly get problems with udev
kernels and my TVcard /dev/video0, and the webcam /dev/video1. Very hit and
miss as to which app gets which video device.

Someone on the list gave me some rules for udev, but they don't appear to be
working. I'll have to start a new thread on that one.

Thanks for the reply.

Nigel.

--

»

Does lilo still have a limit on it's menu entries?

Submitted by Nigel Henry on Sat, 2007-09-29 16:00.

On Saturday 29 September 2007 19:43, Mumia W.. wrote:
> On 09/29/2007 12:23 PM, Nigel Henry wrote:
> > I usually keep all kernels. Alright the ones that don't boot properly can
> > go, but sometimes older, non udev ones, are usefull to keep if you are
> > appearing to have problems with the udev ones. I constantly get problems
> > with udev kernels and my TVcard /dev/video0, and the webcam /dev/video1.
> > Very hit and miss as to which app gets which video device.
> >
> > Someone on the list gave me some rules for udev, but they don't appear to
> > be working. I'll have to start a new thread on that one.
> >
> > Thanks for the reply.
> >
> > Nigel.
>
> To resolve the problems between udev and your tv-card, you might
> consider blacklisting the respective modules and loading the modules in
> a specified order by placing their names in /etc/modules.

Yes. That's an idea. Non udev kernels (2.6.8, and 2.6.11) that use devfs have
no problems. The TV PCI card is constantly /dev/video0, and the USB webcam
is /dev/video1. As soon as Udev enters the equation it's anybodies guess,
what will be what. At the moment on Fedora 7, where I have the same problem,
I have 2 desktop launchers for Xawtv. One pointing to /dev/video0, and the
other to /dev/video1. If one doesn't work, I try the other. It is a bit of a
joke to have to do this though.

Having had problems with USB stuff before, where the USB is started early in
the boot process I think I might try blacklisting just the ov511 driver for
the USB webcam, and then add it, with it's options to /etc/modules. If that
doesn't work, I'll leave it blacklisted, and put it in rc.local, which is run
last, and give that a try.

I'll post back on the results.
>
> To solve another kind of udev problem on my system, I created an
> alternate device nodes directory called /devs2, and I placed my nodes
> there.

Thanks for your help.

Nigel.

--

»

Does lilo still have a limit on it's menu entries?

Submitted by Michelle Konzack on Sun, 2007-09-30 13:00.

Am 2007-09-28 22:18:22, schrieb Nigel Henry:
> I read a while back that earlier versions of lilo could only have 6 entries on
> the menu. My lilo version is 1:22.6.1-9.3.

AFAIK 12 entries with a maximum lenght of 16 chars each

Thanks, Greetings and nice Day
Michelle Konzack
Systemadministrator
Tamay Dogan Network
Debian GNU/Linux Consultant

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