List of minimum needed files for Linux?

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State of the Computing World

Is there a list of the minimum files needed?

Surely someone has made a list of just the
files needed to boot & run a console setup,
& an Xvesa setup, no extra anything at all.

No unneeded apps., commands, libs, etc.
Just boot & run for console & for Xvesa.

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I once grepped the packages

Submitted by pinniped on Thu, 2006-08-10 03:09.

I once grepped the packages list to determine what Debian SID would install in a base installation (this was about 3 months ago) and there were about 64 packages. A few days ago I installed 'Etch' on a very small computer and it put an awful lot more than 64 packages on. Of those 64 (or more) packages in a "base" install, most of them are NOT necessary for a system to run. If, as in my case, you're putting stuff onto a computer with relatively little memory and which will never interact with a human being, you can really cut it down an awful lot more by removing the package manager, documentation, internationalization, etc etc etc.

For a list of what it would take for an even more basic setup, have a look at the "Linux From Scratch" project page. Note: LFS is really handy start if you're doing real embedded development and absolutely have to cut down - to make life easier you need a big computer to help you do all the actual setting up. Even in LFS there are quite a few packages I could eradicate if absolutely necessary.

But basically you need:
1. kernel
2. libc6
3. GNU binutils
4. bash-like shell
5. components to handle a login, if you will have actual users or wish to connect a terminal for troubleshooting.
6. a few extra bits like handy file utilities and a number of tools used to process scripts and logs

Take your time reading through the LFS stuff and spend a week or two actually building LFS on your favorite machine before you build the "tiny" version for your other purposes. At the end of that time you'll even have a better understanding of what can be cut out of your system. How much you can cut down really depends an awful lot on what you want to do. In my case I can really cut things down to:
1. kernel
2. my own custom code, static linked to libc6, to replace "init" and do all the work I need to do on my embedded device.
However, the device I'm working with has enough resources for me to be lazy and put an awful lot of unnecessary stuff which in the end makes the development a bit easier for me.

embedded devices

Submitted by gavinnz on Thu, 2006-08-10 09:10.

Hi pinniped,

Just curious what embedded devices you are using. We are at present developing with GAL, PIC and RF chips for some in house applications. Pretty basic stuff as there are only 3 of us interested at work. Like I said just curious so if you can't or don't want to give anything away that is cool.

PS. sorry to distract from the original thread.

Are we just a blip in history, where the working class had too much access to information and freedom?

I'll use whatever devices I

Submitted by pinniped on Thu, 2006-08-10 17:15.

I'll use whatever devices I can get away with for a project. At the moment I have a fanless Centrino board - I got it so I don't need to build a toolchain and do cross-compiles. Lazy way out and it saves me about 2 weeks work and does the job - this is for a demonstrator item only. If I attract enough funds for full development I will switch to an XScale device for much lower power consumption; that will involve a few months working with the manufacturer to customize a board and all that sort of stuff. I avoid using microcontrollers like the PIC and Atmel if I can - component cost isn't usually an issue for me since I build scientific instruments - i also normally need quite a bit of processing capability in my subsystems. When size, power, or other factors come into play then I might go for some of these microcontrollers.

The FPGAs are amazing - a few years ago I looked at the gate count on one and thought "you can implement a microprocessor with one of these" so I looked up PDP-11 implementations on FPGA - and quite a few companies earn their money selling them. (The PDP just won't die!) Some major astronomical facilities still have a number of PDP-11 and Apple2e machines working ... someone with too much time on their hands could implement an Apple2e-on-a-chip - hahaha. But on the serious side, DEC created the PDP-11 for its mainframe computers about 40 years ago (it evolved from the PDP-8) - these beasts were about the size of a 3-tonne truck. You can now reimplement in FPGA and fit it into a 4U rackmount case - and it will run much faster than the original and consume less power. If you had one of the single-processor machines which were common in laboratory instruments 30 years ago, you could reimplement that in a 1U rackmount rather than the large desk form that they came in.

pinniped; I'll take a closer

Submitted by SunBurnt on Thu, 2006-08-10 23:33.

pinniped; I'll take a closer look at LFS, it might work out... thanks.

gavinnz; We're a blip that knows what's possable & how we've been oppressed.

V for Vendetta

Submitted by gavinnz on Fri, 2006-08-18 23:09.

Quote:

gavinnz; We're a blip that knows what's possible & how we've been oppressed.

Very true and so we are, but blips pass so I intend to ensure that my children know what's possible. Watched a very good movie last night "VforVendetta" the 'making of' comments on the dvd are titled 'Freedom, forever' some interesting social commetary while being a very good watch.

Not as well done but in a similar line is "Ultraviolet"

Are we just a blip in history, where the working class had too much access to information and freedom?

I'm no help but....

Submitted by terryc200607 on Sat, 2006-09-02 00:01.

The point was made on the SLUG[1] list recently that if you are doing embedded stuff, Debian base install is a very poor place to start as so much of the basic stuff has been linked to conglomerate libraries, most of which are unneeded.

You might be better looking at Tom's disk, DSL(?) or something similar.

Alternatively, ask on on of the embbedded (?) usenet groups.

[1]SLUG is Sydney(NSW Australia one) Linux Users Group and the list is unfortunately public on gmane.org. Name of Peter Chubb if you want to read his worthwhile opinion and find the thread.

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